SPEAKER_00 0:04

Welcome to the Veterinary Culture Lab, where science meets real-world application. I'm Andy Davison.

SPEAKER_01 0:12

And I'm Josh Weisman. Together, we'll show you an evidence-based blueprint for renovating culture in your veterinary team. One episode at a time.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

What happens when the career that you've worked so hard for doesn't quite look like the one that you've imagined? Today we're talking about expectations, reality, and how better veterinary cultures can help close that gap. Hey Josh, how's it going?

SPEAKER_02 0:43

Uh, not too bad, Andy. How are you down there in sunny, hot, muggy Florida?

SPEAKER_00 0:48

Oh, that's a perfect way to describe it because that's exactly how we are. It actually rained for the last four days, basically straight, which is weird, right? Like normally we get our afternoon monsoon and then you can move on with your day. But for the last few days, it has been raining and raining and raining and raining. As a result, everything is hot and humid and the grass like growing right in front of your eyeballs.

SPEAKER_02 1:16

No, thank you. I also imagine that when it's raining and raining and raining and raining, the horses just stay in the stalls the whole time.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

Yeah. I mean, they come in as as usual. They come in during the day and then go out at night. Um, but they're, I don't know, they don't, they don't really care, right? I mean, they don't, it doesn't really worry them to be out. If it's like a big scary storm, then I care.

SPEAKER_02 1:38

Yeah. But they are like whatever it's fine with totally fine. That's cool.

SPEAKER_00 1:43

They have little run-in sheds in their paddocks and ask me how many times they use them in the rain.

SPEAKER_02 1:49

How many times do they use them in the rain?

SPEAKER_00 1:51

Big fat zero. Like they're never in there.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

Yeah. They're never so they do they is it that they don't mind the rain or that they enjoy it?

SPEAKER_00 2:00

It's probably different for each horse. I mean, they're not out there like frolicking in it, but they're they just keep eating. I think they probably just don't mind, right? Like, eh, no big deal. I can still graze and do my thing, even if I'm getting wet.

SPEAKER_02 2:12

There's no Dick Van Dyke in the background.

SPEAKER_00 2:14

Right, right, right, right. There are no umbrellas and lampposts.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Got it. Got it. Andy, I have a question for you actually. Um that uh is just top of mind for me. If you could travel to the moon, would you?

SPEAKER_00 2:28

Um yeah, I think so. I think so. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 2:32

I just I'm thinking about like, I don't know if you've heard this, but there's been talk of like building a moon base for a while. I think like the whole Space Force thing, and but apparently, like Elon Musk, because he's not rich enough yet and doesn't isn't involved in enough ventures. Apparently, he's like talking about actually like using SpaceX to build a base on the moon so that there could be like transport, like like common folk transport, right? Like so you and I could so you could vacation. I say I say you and I it would probably be like hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars for a ticket, but yeah, so like yeah, you could, you know, through SpaceX or whatever, you could go to the moon and I don't know, take a moon vacation. Yeah, something like that. And then he's like, he's working with high-end um chefs to make like fancy restaurants and things like that. And I got to yeah, I got to thinking about that, like a restaurant on the moon. That's kind of cool, especially if you're working with, you know, I don't know, a Michelin star type chef. The food's probably pretty good, but I'll bet the restaurant's not gonna have any atmosphere.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

I knew it. I'm like, there's a joke in here somewhere. I think, I think there is. He's still talking about it. I think there's oh, there it is.

SPEAKER_02 3:38

There it is. End with that.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

End with that, yeah. No, that's actually really funny because I'm um holding up my little uh a little stuffy that I actually shared this on our social media not too long ago because Percy has a new friend and it is moon related. I don't know if any of our listeners or even you, Josh, followed the Artemis mission recently where they went around the backside of the moon with the team and the crew and like Christina, and she's so cool, and I would love to meet her. And my friend and I got really into it, right? Like we watched all the videos and we would follow their trip along and everything. And one of the things that they did is that they put out a contest for um the kids to create something that the astronauts would take into space with them. And this little dude is, I think it's a moon, and he's wearing a baseball hat with a earth on like the earth is on it. And his name is Rise, and he went to the moon with the Artemis II crew. And of course, they have all the videos online of Rise, and they're like, you know, playing with him in the zero gravity, and he's floating around in the background of all of the uh videos that they made. And then when they came home, they would still are traveling around and talking about their experience, and they take Rise with them to every event. So he's basically their person, which I thought was really, really cool. And my friend Emily, because she knows me so well, she recently got me my own Rise, and now I have a Rise, and Percy has a Rise. And so they're like sharing their and it is just fascinating to listen to, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:17

That's awesome. I know random stuff.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

He is super cute.

SPEAKER_02 5:21

Thanks for sharing it. He's super cute.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

Oh gosh. Well, you know something else I've been thinking about a little bit lately is the idea behind expectations. So, not the expectations that other people put on us, but the expectations that we put on ourselves. Like when we're younger, right? We build this picture in our head of what we think our career is gonna be like. We imagine the moments that are gonna be important to us, the ones that we think that we'll remember, the impact that we'll have, the kind of professional that we'll become. And maybe that's a veterinarian, maybe that's a veterinary technician, heck, maybe that is an astronaut who is gonna one day circle the dark side of the moon. And then one day we actually get there and it becomes a reality. And sometimes it looks exactly like we imagined, and other times it does not. You know, I can still remember deciding that I wanted to become a veterinary technician. And for me, it was way more about something inside of me, being a part of something that mattered. I wanted to be one of those people that knew her shit, could walk in a room, make a difference, and know that because of me, an animal and the people that loved it could have a better day. And I remember being in tech school and thinking, okay, here I am. I'm learning the things, I'm going through all my courses, I'm out in clinics, I'm gonna take boards. And once I graduate, I will have made it. Like somehow, graduation was that finish line. And then I graduated and I passed my boards, and I remember getting my letter because yes, I am old enough that it was a paper letter. And I was sitting on my couch alone, staring at the letter and staring at the words past. And I remember that that was a pinnacle moment in my career, and I knew that this was it. This was the place that I needed to be, and that this was the place that I had worked towards. When in reality, that place, it wasn't the finish line. It was actually the starting line. And nobody really talks about what happens after you become the thing that you've worked so hard to become. When all of those expectations that you've set for yourself come into focus, some of them they become exactly what I've hoped for. Like watching Molly successfully waddle back to her mom after we've put that de-gloving injury back together. Those were things that were exactly the way that I hoped they would be. But there were also things that I didn't expect. And they left me tired and deflated. Like this constant competition that tends to happen in our profession. Politics, being questioned, invisible, having to defend my knowledge and education. Here's the thing though, none of those things made me love Vet Med any less. In fact, I probably love this profession more today than I did 20 years ago. But I love it differently. And looking back now, I don't think my expectations were unrealistic. I just think that I'm still writing my story 20 years later. So, Josh, I'm curious, when you first decided that veterinary medicine was the right path for you, what did you picture in your head?

SPEAKER_02 8:58

Uh, I originally thought that I was gonna go to vet school. The joke that I often use, which I'm sorry to our veterinarian listeners out there, uh just recall this is a little bit tongue-in-cheek. Um, yeah, I thought I was gonna go to vet school, but I have since been disabused of vet psychosis. Uh yeah, that so originally when I when I decided that I was I wanted to work in veterinary medicine, I started working out of practice because I wanted experience for when I applied to vet school, which I never did.

SPEAKER_00 9:29

So then when you look back on your career, right? Because you didn't go to vet school, but you still are in vet med, what parts of those expectations that you set for yourself ended up coming true? And what parts did you never see coming?

SPEAKER_02 9:42

Oh, I honestly I think that almost all of it I never I didn't never saw coming. I think that that yeah, what what I imagined my career in veteran medicine to be like when I first came to the profession. Um, if I could go back in time and talk to that Josh, uh, you know, 30 odd years ago, whatever it is, uh, I'm sure he would describe something completely different than what it feels like right now. I mean, I I think it's probably uh the the age-old story, you know, I was drawn to vetmed because I love animals and I find medicine and science fascinating. Um that's not what VetMed is about for me now. For for me now, it's really it's not that it's not about the animals. It it it is. I love animals. My wife and I, as you know, have you know a small zoo here at the house and we will always have you know animals in our life. But really what what fuels me and what keeps me engaged in the profession is is the people of veterinary medicine. It's not it's not even like the people that we serve, it's the people within the profession. Um, and that's very, very different for me now.

SPEAKER_00 10:45

Yeah, yeah. So the expectation that you had way back then, I mean just yesterday, when you entered into the veterinary field, it's a little bit different than what became a reality for you.

SPEAKER_02 10:58

Yeah, absolutely. I think I also expected that uh, you know, this work, this field would feel so meaningful and you know, just seeping in purpose and you know, the old cliche if you love what you do, you never work a day in your life. And I thought that's what it would feel like. And that is certainly not how it played out. Um yes, it is absolutely meaningful work, uh, both when I was working in clinical practice and now doing this work at Flourished, uh incredibly meaningful to me. Um I feel a deep sense of purpose in the work that I do, and it does fuel me and and push me forward, drives me forward, shapes how I do things, what I do, and where I spend my time and energy. Uh, but I absolutely work almost every day of my life. The stressors are real, the challenges are real, they take a toll sometimes. Like I don't think I I expected it to feel like that because of, you know, the picture that I had of what vetment was going to be like.

SPEAKER_00 11:57

Yeah, the beautiful watercolor that you painted in your head.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Yeah, absolutely. For sure. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 12:02

For sure. Yeah. And that absolutely leads us beautifully into the paper that I brought for us to talk about today. The title is The Newly Credentialed Veterinary Technician: Perceptions, Realities, and Career Challenges. It was published earlier this year in Frontiers in Veterinary Science by some super fantastic people that we know and love in VetMed. The authors of this paper are Addy Reinhard, Victoria Selt, Leah Paluki, and Marielle Hendricks. Now, at first glance, I have to admit, like very quietly, that I kind of expected this to be another burnout paper. But I should have known better because this crew put together something fantastic. And it's in a really, really good way. Because rather than focusing on one issue, what they did is they zoomed out and they asked a much more interesting question. They wanted to know what it's actually like to become a newly credentialed veterinary technician. And rather than sending out another survey with rating scales, they chose a qualitative approach. So they recruited 17 credentialed veterinary technicians who had graduated within the previous seven years. These technicians, they came from all sorts of practice settings: general practice, emergency, specialty, equine, academia, industry, all the things. And they brought them together in four 90-minute focus groups. And they simply talked. The researchers, they asked open-ended questions. Stuff like, what was the transition into practice really like? What challenges have you faced? What prepared you well? And what didn't? When they analyzed those conversations looking for recurring themes, they found two that fit into some pretty big buckets. The first is what they call the credentialing journey. And the second was the challenges within the career. So let's start with the credentialing journey. One of the first things that the researchers found was that technicians entered tech school and the credentialing process with a lot of hope. They wanted deeper medical knowledge. Some hoped for better pay. Others simply wanted to provide better patient care. But once they entered practice, many described a gap between that expectation and reality. Some said that after becoming credentialed, almost nothing changed except the letters after their name and maybe a small pay raise. Others found themselves suddenly expected to train assistants, take on leadership responsibilities with very little guidance and support. And several described feeling that while school had prepared them technically, it hadn't really prepared them emotionally for the realities of practice. Then the researchers turned to those day-to-day challenges that the technicians described once they were out in practice. Here, seven themes emerged. But really a few of them stood out to me. The first one didn't surprise me a ton. It might surprise some of our listeners, but it was conflict. And it wasn't conflict between clients. It was actually conflict among the team. The researchers titled this theme, Us versus Us. Technicians described conflict across the team, being yelled at, feeling unable to speak up. Reading that section, it became pretty clear that many of the hardest parts of this profession are not the medical parts at all. But the finding that really grabbed my attention was around utilization. Over and over again, technicians describe feeling overworked and underutilized all at the same time. They weren't saying that they didn't have enough to do, quite the opposite. They described spending huge amounts of time doing work that almost anyone could do while rarely getting to use many of the technical skill that they'd spent so many years learning. One of the other themes that came up was that this career was being questioned for its sustainability. Not because they didn't love veterinary medicine, but because of the physical demands, the emotional demands, the limited career advancement, and uncertainty about what the future even looked like if they wanted or needed to keep growing. So when the researchers stepped back and asked, all right, what do we do with all of this? The recommendations were actually not about making technicians tougher, grittier, or more resilient. Instead, these authors focused on the workplace itself. They called for stronger leadership, better conflict management, true team-based medicine, and greater utilization of technician skills. And Josh, I think that's where this paper gets really interesting. Because to me, this isn't actually a paper about technician burnout. It's a paper about the gap between what we hope our profession will be and what the actual experience is once we get there. And if that's true, then this isn't just a technician problem. This stretches across the board to everyone in our industry. Now, the paper itself, it reminds us that techs, they often feel overworked and underutilized. In fact, this is something that I hear all the time and have absolutely experienced myself out in the wild. And Josh, I really don't think that utilization is about task lists. I think it's about trust. It's about whether somebody believes in your expertise and invites you in to use it, which is why utilized stings so much. It doesn't just affect what we do, it affects how we see ourselves professionally. Josh, I'm curious, what does it mean to you to truly utilize somebody well?

SPEAKER_02 17:53

That's a great question. I mean, I think I think you nailed one of the key characteristics, which is this idea of trust. It's a demonstration of trust. Um, utilization, I think, from an individual's perspective is this subjective belief that uh others around me, to your point, um, see my strength, see my worth, value it, and trust uh uh trust me to you know put those things to use. So I think those are really, really essential elements. Um, I think utilization, also to your point, you sort of subtly addressed it. It's not just about getting people to do things or including people, right? Um, you know, Zach Mercurio sometimes talks about the difference between inclusion and belonging and mattering. And I think this actually is really quite apropos here. Um, to tell to keep somebody to busy, to have them do a bunch of tasks, even tasks that are within the um schema of what a veterinary technician does um filling their day with tasks that they are trained to do that are unique to their position may not actually feel like utilization to that person because it's just including them without actually helping them see how their unique strength and worth offers unique contribution that matters in that environment. And so I I think utilization is also about that. It's about understanding uh where where somebody's passions lie, where their interests lie, where they want to stretch and grow, uh, and then giving them opportunities to put those things to good work, uh, and then showing them the evidence of the unique contribution that they've made when they've used those things.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

Yeah, I love that. So it's not just trusting and believing that I can place that Ivy catheter in the two-week old kitten. It's knowing that neonatal medicine is exciting for me and that cats are my jam and I've got nine of them at home. And I get really excited when, you know, I can I can hit the vein and place that catheter, and that just that gets me all excited. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:02

Yeah. Yeah. Or, or knowing that you're excited for neonatal medicine, but you're not yet that good at placing catheters in kittens. And I'm still going to give you opportunities to practice that skill in a safe way and help you develop it. That's also a form of utilization.

SPEAKER_00 20:19

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yep. I love that. Whoo, we're going to talk about that more later. Another strong theme, though, that kept coming up for me over and over and over surrounds that effect, right, that our work relationships have on our professional experience. This paper reiterates that disrespect, unproductive communication, and feeling unheard create a huge divide in our clinics and our teams. And yeah, the paper was technically focused on vet tech specifically, but I am absolutely certain that this applies across the board because come on, we are all humans. Humans who have the need to belong and feel seen and valued. And that's where I think that recognition comes in. Because sometimes we think that recognition means praise, right? Or winning employee of the month. But what if recognition is something so much deeper than that? Now, I realize that you've kind of, we've kind of touched on this already, but I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of kick the door open a little bit more because what do you think it could look like for somebody to feel recognized, even if they never hear the words, way to go, or you're a rock star, or earn some silly award.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

Yeah, I mean, I think I think those are forms of recognition that are important. Uh, you know, we do need to thank people for their contributions. We need to point out the things that they do well. We need to express, you know, some form of gratitude or appreciation for the things that people do in the workplace. Um, otherwise, we, you know, at the very least, we risk uh creating an environment where it's like, Andy, the only time you hear from me is when I call you. Into my office because you've done something wrong, right? Like the old, like Andy, if I if you were working in a clinic and the manager said, Step into my office, how would you feel? Like for most of us, most of the time, yeah, yeah, yeah. We we get rigid and the hawks go up and we're like, okay, something is wrong, right? Like that's a that's a problem. I think that's a clear indication that there's probably a relatively low level of the sort of like that standard or base kind of recognition. But I think what you're touching on, though, is a form of recognition that can really be thought of as somebody just feeling seen in the workplace. You know, that that you see who I am, you see what I bring to the table, you see my values, you see my strengths, you see my potential. Um, but you don't just see those things, you demonstrate it. Like that's how we feel recognized. Like uh you can you can see somebody's worth or special qualities or unique magic or whatever as clearly as the front yard on a sunny day, you know. Um, but if they don't know that you see that, they won't feel recognized by you. You have to demonstrate it as well. So it's it's the seeing the person and then demonstrating it. And an example of this, where it's gone wrong that I've seen, uh, you know, I know somebody who works in a pretty high stress environment. It's a professional environment. Um, this person is incredibly talented, uh, well educated, and experienced. And in this work environment, they're under a lot of pressure to meet some very specific deadlines of which the company depends upon. The company's ability to make revenue depends upon this, right? So there's a ton of pressure to meet these deadlines. This individual I happen to know um really prides themselves on being seen as a contributor, like a team player, somebody who helps the team and the individuals within the team achieve their goals. Very important to this person. This person routinely has meetings with people in direct leadership, so like one level above them and two levels above them. And in either of those meetings, they really feel like the only things that are discussed are the things that are falling short, the things that aren't working out, the things that need repair, the stuff that, you know, uh needs to be improved upon, or uh, don't forget about that deadline, right? Like things like that, right? And so this person is left feeling unrecognized for their contributions and losing motivation over it because that's all they hear about. Not the things that they've done well for the 40 or 50 hours of the week that they've worked, but the small things that still need to be done or need to be improved upon. So that recognition will help somebody, not it's not about ignoring those things that need to be done better or improved or focused on or prioritized. It's not about ignoring that. It's about ensuring that all the other stuff is also recognized. You know, you you're completely meeting and exceeding my expectations, and here's why. You're such an essential member of this team, and here's why. And Andy, here are one or two ways that you could get even better, right? Like that is, I think, a suitable form of recognition that most of us are missing out on.

SPEAKER_00 25:39

Yeah, heck yeah. That it's more than just way to go, good job, that it's it's deeper than that. And it's recognizing somebody for the strengths that they're bringing to the situation, the unique way that they're supporting the thing, right? The cause, the mission, the goal, and showing them that you see that. That's that's really the big thing that you know you said that stood out to me is that it's not just about knowing how they're contributing, it's showing them that they are contributing, which is different than showing them that you're noticing that they're contributing. It's more than that. It's getting them to believe that they are an essential member of the team.

SPEAKER_02 26:21

Yeah. I I can I add something to this? Yeah, please. Um might be a little bit controversial and certainly will rub some listeners the wrong way, but I really firmly believe this. And I hope that people can be uh can can accept this with some thoughtfulness. Um the simplest form of this uh for anybody in any sort of a leadership or management position is thinking about each individual on your team and imagining what would be missing if that person left and never came back, and then expressing that to them. Like so one of the easiest forms of that is gosh, if it weren't for you, right? Or because of you and finishing those statements. So think about what what would be missing in this workplace? What would what would we struggle with? What would we fall short on? What would not get done well? Like, what would be missing if this person disappeared, and then expressing that to that person uh using a framework like because of you? If you have an individual on your team that you think uh there's nothing that would be missing, in fact, it might be a blessing if they were gone. That is a flaw that you are responsible for dealing with. That is not a flaw in that individual. Uh I say that because either you hired them, you're keeping them on the job, you're not helping them find a place to succeed. That's your responsibility. Or you have not placed yourself properly in the position to see their magic and strength. And I'm gonna guess that more often than not, it's the latter and not the former. And as a manager, you need to do a better job of seeing the unique special contributions that this person brings to the table and then showing them that you see those things. Okay, off of my high horse.

SPEAKER_00 28:07

Oh, I it's a good looking high horse, though. I I yeah, yes, I I agree with that. I think that there's a lot, a lot to be learned from the back of that high horse.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

Yeah, and these suggestions, right? Because we're already getting into the the good part, the suggestions are really great stepping stones that are gonna kind of lead into a bigger conversation here because the paper really makes it clear that it is our culture and that our culture can be a huge contributor to the challenges that come with establishing yourself as a credentialed technician and probably a veterinary professional in general. Okay. And now that we know more about what will be helpful in lifting up our newly credentialed technicians, let's talk more about what we can specifically do to put that into action, like right now. Josh, you and I, we've already touched on a lot of them and we've already shared some thoughts and some suggestions, touched a bit on relationships, recognition, utilization, right? Which are critical components to thriving. But here's what really struck me, especially as a credentialed technician myself. Several technicians in the study, they questioned whether this was a career that they could sustain over the long haul. They talked about both the physical and emotional demands and the developmental opportunities. And I heard that loud and clear, because yes, it isn't always sustainable to bend over and flip the bed-ridden premi dummy bowl day in and day out. My back hurts just thinking about it. So I get it for sure. But that's why I think that that sustainability question is really a valid one. And it's honestly one that I think leaders should be asking right alongside of their technicians. Now, those of you that know me know that I kind of am in love with this profession. And that one of the biggest reasons why I love it so much is the variety that comes with it. I am living proof that becoming a tech can be way more than doing dentals, sterilizing packs, and jogging horses. Veterinary technology is not a dead-end career. Yet sometimes we create workplaces that accidentally make it feel like it is one. So let's change that. Let's create visible pathways for growth. Ask the techs on your team, where do you see yourself in two years? What gets you excited about a career in vetmed? Josh, have you ever had a leader ask you a question like that? Nope. Yeah. See, there we go. Once you learn more about what that's like, what gets them excited? Get excited with them. Let's say that somebody tells you that they are fascinated by dentistry. Fantastic. Now your job as a leader is to start creating little stepping stones towards that future. Let them know when a cool dental procedure gets booked. Put them in the OR that day. Ask them if they'd like to present a good little pearl at rounds that they learned. Or, oh, what about this? Give them the opportunity to get lunch, yes, on a workday with the boarded traveling dentist that sees patients at your clinic twice a month. Just think of the incredible conversations that might happen at a table when something like that is possible. And here's the best part about it supporting the sustainable career path, it doesn't always require a huge budget. Yes, sometimes you can send them to that kick-ass CE in Zimbabwe or buy them a new training manual, but you could also forward them a super cool podcast that might be helpful or introduce them to somebody that you admire in your professional network. Invest in your technicians. Show them that you believe in their goals because stuff like this says, I see your future and I really want to help you get there. So clearly, Josh, this one means a lot to me. And I have oodles of ideas, right, on how to support that. But nobody wants to hear me go on and on forever here. So, what are some ideas and thoughts that you want to bring into the ring?

SPEAKER_02 32:18

When it comes to specifically like uh pathways for growth?

SPEAKER_00 32:22

Not anything really. Putting some of this in action, supporting our technician. We know what they need. How do we do it?

SPEAKER_02 32:29

Yeah. I mean, it I don't think it's rocket science. I think talking to them about it is probably the best place to start. Uh yeah, I do think that the the pathways for growth thing is like really important. One of the things that's troubled me for the past several years, um this is this is not uh specific to veterinary medicine. I think this extends to a lot of different industries, but certainly we are as guilty of it as anybody in vetmed. It feels like the only pathway for growth are um upward mobility. Uh, that if you want to grow in your role as a vet tech, that means you have to become a manager, you have to become a supervisor, you have to get into like, you know, the the management track is the only way to grow. Uh, I don't think that's appropriate. First of all, not everybody aspires to do that. Not everybody is uh prepared to do that, not everybody wants to do that. Uh, and we need to create alternative pathways for development that don't involve management. Um, so I I would start by just like really bringing the technicians together and facilitating a conversation with them to talk about what do we do to create multiple pathways for growth here? So, like clarifying what a management growth path is. So some of you are going to want to move into higher-level leadership roles, take on more responsibility, things like that. That's great. Let's clarify what that is, what that looks like, what it will take, how will how we will identify people, how we will help support people and developing those skills, how we'll promote and move people up, create that, make it clear, uh, make it tangible, make it achievable. Then for everybody else who probably won't want to do that, or let's be real, if you're in a small practice, there's only one of them that's gonna be able to move into that role, right? But for everybody else, let's talk about what would an alternative developmental path look like? What would it look like to grow in this practice without moving into management? Like have and make that a group conversation, lay it out, make it specific, create, you know, a structure for it, build it, and then uh and then live it. Um, give them the opportunity to actually lean into that and and do that growth. I I think I think that's at least one way that we can apply some of these lessons.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

One of the many, right?

SPEAKER_02 34:46

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 34:47

I mean, that that one, I'm like bouncing in my chair listening to you talk about that because I love that. You're so right. There are a lot of people out there. And I I used to work with an amazing technician that didn't want to be a leader. She did not want to move into management, she just didn't want to do that. And I know that because of that, she felt limited in what was possible in her career. And so finding other ways to allow technicians specifically, because that's where my heart is, but that's also where the article is, to grow is so important. And yes, leadership might be able to come up with what that looks like, but wow, you know who would be able to come up with what that looks like? The technicians. They know or they have some idea of what would be meaningful enough to them to qualify as growth and to get them excited to do it and stick around and invest, right? So, I mean, that kind of gets me excited. I would love to hear what the technician demographic sees as growth when leadership isn't something that you really are into, which is cool because not everybody is. So, what what what else gets you excited? Like that would be an awesome conversation to have with a team of technicians at your clinic. Wow. Yeah, for real. Mm-mm. I know. I get excited. I know you can't see me, listeners, but I like bounce around in my chair when I get really excited and I am bouncing around in my chair. Um, yeah. So anyway, this paper, it leaves us hopeful, at least it leaves me hopeful that veterinary technicians, they're not asking for an easier profession. They're asking for opportunities to grow. They're asking for ways to contribute. They're looking for opportunities to build their career and make it one that they can see themselves in for years to come. And that is hopeful for me. And no, we can't eliminate every challenge that comes with FedMed, but we absolutely can create cultures where people feel trusted, valued, and excited about what is possible. Because when we invest in our people, not just their skill, but their future, we don't just retain great technicians. We help build a stronger profession for all of us. Now, given the fact that this episode is about technicians, and given the fact that I am one, I have brought a Florida woman headline to this episode, which I know they're rare because of obvious reasons, but this Florida woman headline, it this, I mean, I just shake your head, right? You just shake your head. All right. This happened in Charlotte County in Florida. And the headline reads Florida woman pulls random alligator out of her pants during a traffic stop. Right? Now there's a photo of the alligator, which thankfully is a very small alligator. It looks like a baby alligator. It's maybe like, I don't know, a foot-ish, maybe longer. So it's not like it's a gargantuan alligator, but still, she had it in her pants and she pulled it out of her pants. Apparently, she was stopped for um some traffic concern that was not stated in the article. And the officers were asking what she had in the vehicle because she had uh a bunch of other reptiles that she shouldn't have. And so then the officers asked her if she had anything else, and out comes the baby alligator from her pants.

SPEAKER_02 38:28

Out comes the baby. That's there's so much about this that I'm like, I'm thinking about Florida and how loose the rules are on how animals you can have. And then I'm like, Right, what kind of reptiles does somebody have in their car that in Florida they're like, oh no, those are not okay?

SPEAKER_00 38:43

It was 41 three-striped mud turtles. That would raise my eyebrow. If you had one three-striped mud turtle, maybe, but 41? That's a lot.

SPEAKER_02 38:53

Also, how many different versions of mud turtles are there? Is there like a two-stripe or a four-stripe version? Do we know?

SPEAKER_00 39:00

That I know. All of the things that Florida woman makes you ponder.

SPEAKER_02 39:04

Florida delivers once again.

SPEAKER_00 39:06

Yep. Yep. Now, just in case anybody's out there wondering, I did scroll through the article and rest assured, the animals were taken into custody by the Fish and Wildlife Conservation. So the turtles, the 41 turtles, and the pants skater are all okay, which is important. All right. Cool, cool. Well, thank you for talking through this article and having this awesome conversation. And thanks to our listeners for coming and being part of it as well. If you enjoyed it, we would be really grateful if you would subscribe to the show, leave us a review, or share it with somebody who is just as passionate about building a better veterinary profession as you are. Until next time, friends, bye.

SPEAKER_02 39:48

Take care.

SPEAKER_00 39:52

Thanks for hanging out with us in the Veterinary Culture Lab, covered by the science of workplace well-being, and brought to you by Flourish Veterinary Consulting. If today's episode sparked an idea, made you smile, or got you thinking, hey, I should totally try that. Let us know. What do you think? Be sure to subscribe, share, and remember a thriving veterinary culture is possible, and you don't have to build it alone.